Forum:Otaku Discussion
Well the word "moe" is truly shrouded by mystery. It's been abused in so many situations that the word moe itself doesn't really have a meaning. Here in Japan, there are lots of otaku who are in my class say "moe moe" like 24/7. I don't think they even know what the word "moe" truly means. Basically from what i'm inferring, its meaning is probably something that has to do with like a stereotype attribute or scene that appeals to the otaku populace. Saeko herself obviously sells due to her sex appeal, and learning from the true otaku, purple haired characters in manga and anime series are often the "sexy" character. One must also not forget her "dere" when she's with Takashi. I think that's also a major selling point she's got that the other characters don't have, which highly attracts the male audience. You mentioned a point of Saeko being associated as the "nee-san" type girl. I'd agree with you more or less, but I haven't heard that from anyone here yet. Obviously doesn't rule out the possibility, eh? Haha I noticed you used the terminology of "wannabe-otaku". Personally i think most viewers of this show would be otaku, but back in Canada, most viewers i know AREN'T otaku people. I'd say they are "pseudo-otaku". Mainly because they are all men of 6 ft plus and play contact sports with passion. I guess they are all just closet-otakus like how I sort of am. Somehow, I dislike being branded with the mark as an "otaku". I think there's somewhat of a negative connotation as when I hear otaku, I think " fat, sweaty, weares glasses, short, and likes too much ecchi stuff". On the contrast, I'm 185 cm, fit, 20/20 vision, but yet my actions resemble those of an otaku, except for buying dolls and whatnot. God bless the worldDonutsonfire 08:33, January 17, 2011 (UTC) My professor from my Japanese Culture class explained moe as a platonic relationship in which the girl makes the guy feel comfortable and satisfies him in a non-sexual way. She used the maid cafes as an example of where this type of relationship takes place. I think you're right though about it not really having a meaning anymore. I used "wannabe-otaku" because I think many people in America call themselves "otaku" because they like anime or manga. In my opinion, you're an otaku if you're in Japan. If you're in America, you're a nerd or geek. The terms basically mean the same thing. I think a lot of people don't realize that you can be an otaku about things other than anime or manga. Also, calling yourself an otaku sounds a lot better than calling yourself a nerd, but if you go to Japan and call yourself an otaku, it would be the same as calling yourself a nerd here. Finally, I don't think a lot of the "wannabe-otaku" understand the level of obsession associated with the term. They may be enthusiasts, but probably not otaku. Personally, I don't mind being called an otaku, but since I'm American, I typically call myself a nerd. I don't really fit the stereotype though, so most people don't think of me as one unless they really get to know me.Turambar1 ''' 17:30, January 17, 2011 (UTC) im a natural born geek, i love reading comics, manga, and watching anime, but im not wat u called a otaku because i really not into anime like tht when u have to buy the freaking $50 dolls for a souvenier thts how much some of these action figures are for $50 DOLLARS or even close to 300 ridiculous.MrPacheco101 19:08, January 17, 2011 (UTC) Yeah I agree to the country thing. It seems to make much more sense when you make a comparison like that! Also, I forgot to mention the fortune that these otaku spend on plastic dolls! I get the occasional $30-$50 ones, but the $100+ is kinda outrageous to me. Why would you spend $100 for something that is only an eyecandy for a short time? Well at least Otaku can have their dolls and nerds can have their computers. It works out both ways :D. Being an Asian rocks...you can be good with computer and still not get called a nerd! HahahaDonutsonfire 23:40, January 17, 2011 (UTC) Yeah $100 does sound like too much, but I'm not one to criticize. I don't necessarily spend a lot on anime and manga stuff (other than HOTD), but I am an avid Star Wars collector, and I don't mind spending excessive amounts of money on stuff I really don't need. When I went to the SW convention last year, I spent around $500 on collectibles in the first three days. The most ridiculous part of it though is that I don't take anything out of its original packaging, so I basically just buy the stuff to look at in its package. It might actually be cheaper if I started collecting the plastic dolls instead. There's much less to collect as long as you focus on one or two series at a time.Turambar1 ' 01:28, January 18, 2011 (UTC) Technically sticking to one or two series is cheaper, and I can agree to that as I have at least 20+ Master Grade Gundams at my house, but real otaku collect from a large number of series. I'm not sure if you are associated with Danny Choo, the famous webblogger / stormtropper in Akihabara, but he has a magazine he releases in cooperation with Kotobukiya called "Otacool". Otacool features rooms of otakus worldwide. Some of their anime and manga dolls occupy entire shelves, rows upon rows. I don't think one could compare to that. Also, they do include series from North America, and as you said Star Wars, which is very popular with retro otakus. Personally, I know of the expense Star Wars collectors have to undergo to purchase their rare finds, but the products otakus buy is not that chapter either as mentioned above, $100-$300. What's burning a hole in their pocket is not just a couple of figures from a series but more like 10+ figures from at least 20 series. Now i know why they can't afford dates and eat from convenient store nomsDonutsonfire 02:12, January 18, 2011 (UTC) I moved our otaku conversation her since it was getting off-topic. I can't say I'm familiar with that magazine, but I have seen some Japanese SW collections. I saw one where a guy had a huge R2-D2 focus collection. It was pretty amazing because he designed the entire room to look like kind of an inverted R2-D2 with a domed ceiling and everything. He had a couple hundred vintage action figures, which is quite impressive as a character like that can go for anywhere from a few hundred to a couple thousand dollars apiece. Vintage figures are one thing, but paying hundreds of dollars for PVC figures seems pointless. I can't blame them though because I understand the collector's need to have something just simply to have it, and publishers and their licensees understand this as well. As my Japanese professor said otaku are just "victims of post-modern Capitalism in Japan." If not for the otaku spending so much, Japan may not have recovered so well in the post-bubble economy.'Turambar1 ' 03:41, January 18, 2011 (UTC) Thanks for moving it! I was wondering if i should move it, but looks like the early bird got the worm! Haha! Agreed. Also don't forget the high expense of having a Japanese daughter these days! Those ganguro or gyaru girls spend more than a fortune on makeup each year! It's absolutely ridiculous how far they go just to please their egos or to please guys. Anyways, back on topic, I understand about collection vintages, which eventually going to be and are extremely valuable! Defending the otaku's perspective, their "limited edition" dolls or figurines that they lined up @ midnight in Akihabara to get will soon be as pricey as those Star Wars figurines. Not that some will reach that potential but I'm sure certain products will be, such as in the future, I bet the UCC Evangelion can set will be highly prized amongst true otakus. Even I have one! Haha! I guess this hoarding of dolls and limited edition products is just to fulfill the desires of otakus and perhaps they keep them in hopes of selling them at higher prices later on! I think this is the same for all limited edition items, right? Also, our HOTD secret boxes could potentially be highly valued since they are selling the last of them as we speak (I just bought one now again. Just to keep it boxed & it came as a bundle deal with a Saeko Busujima figurine for Donutsonfiresomething yen...forgot already!). Anyways, I guess Japanese people should thank otakus for their contribution to the economy? Hahaha!!!!Donutsonfire 04:05, January 18, 2011 (UTC) Yeah, I've heard pretty much every girl over there has a Prada or Gucci bag. Those don't come cheap. Those "limited edition" products are actually a pretty clever marketing scheme. It allows them to overcharge and make a much larger profit and it basically ensures that every item produced will be sold. I didn't realize the Secret Box was in limited quantity. Around the time the series ends that stuff will probably sell for quite a profit, but I don't intend to ever sell mine. Believe it or not, after the "bubble burst" in the early 90's and people stopped spending money, manga and anime was one of the few markets which actually went up in sales. Companies capitalized on this by making all kinds of products, and otaku became notable contributors to the economy. That's why they also became an excepted part of the society after the "otaku killer" incident made people shun them. Anyway, it's pretty amazing to think of how the many millions (if not billions) of dollars are made every year thanks to figures that probably cost barely $1 each to produce.'Turambar1 ' 04:54, January 18, 2011 (UTC) Yeah thats what most of my friends tell me about limited edition products. It's so true that it's scary how we get lured in by 2 simple words : "limited edition". I had no idea otakus were that much of an economic booster. Maybe we dislike otakus because of the otaku killer incident, but I think most of them, deep down, are all nice folks who aren't your stereotypical fat guy at home jerking off to hentai. Sure some of them do, but I don't think they are as creepily as society has made us to think about them. Also, I'm actually pretty sure those figurines cost a bit more than $1. Unless it's something small and made in china with low quality, there's no way it takes $1 to produce. My parents are cap (hats) manufacturers for New Era caps, and they said that the cost of the product is mainly because of the mold fees, not really the material fees. But, thats wool and cotton or polyester, not high grade plastic. Therefore, I think it must take some sort of difficulty to produce those figurines, otherwise who would be the dolls for $100+? It must be justified somewhat!Donutsonfire 05:09, January 18, 2011 (UTC) I personally think the otaku killer was mislabeled. He was just an ordinary psychopath with a taste for the flesh of young girls who just happened to be obsessed with extremely graphic horror hentai. The really sick stuff, like if they made an anime from the work of Suehiro Maruo, if you're familiar with that. If not, I'd strongly advise against reading it. Anyway, I was talking more about the materials. PVC isn't exactly expensive, and I doubt the paint is either. When you factor in the cost of molds, running the factory, paying employees, and packaging you're probably closer to around $10. If any part is handmade, which is usually just enough for it to legally be labeled "handmade," then it would be a bit more. The reason these companies are able to sell these figures for so much is because of the concept of supply and demand. This goes back to the limited edition thing. They make it known that the supply is low, and the demand goes up so people are willing to pay more.'Turambar1 ' 05:45, January 18, 2011 (UTC) Yeah I don't think I'm gonna be reading any of that type of manga/anime anytime soon. I'm not sure about their country of origin but if it's made in japan, the price is like a 5 to 1 ratio compared to something made in China. Dang those bastards. Thank god i'm not into figurines...unless it's Saeko XDDonutsonfire 05:59, January 18, 2011 (UTC) Who is the "otaku killer"?MrPacheco101 19:36, January 18, 2011 (UTC) I don't really feel like explaining it completely so here's a link to the wikipedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsutomu_Miyazaki He was basically the reason they started putting restrictions on the amount of violence allowed in manga and anime. I'm sure some of those figures are made in China, but I'm sure most are made in Japan. The ones from Japan are definitely of better quality and therefore more costly. That $1 apiece production cost I mentioned probably isn't too far off from what it costs in China. Speaking of Saeko figures, you're lucky you'll actually be able to get the mail-in offer for the free Saeko figure from buying all four Full Color Editions. I won't be eligible because I don't live in Japan.'Turambar1 ' 22:20, January 18, 2011 (UTC) Oh that guy, i can't say that hes a "otaku killer", because the guy using "manga violence" as a scapegoat is all bullshit, serial killers are not born out of what they watch and what they read they're born out of what happen to them or what they percieve in their own mind. gevernment used tht serial killers method as a way to supress what people can do with free speech which is somewhat a good case.MrPacheco101 22:53, January 18, 2011 (UTC) I don't know if you guys have watched Oreimo, but in there, there's a similar incident of an "otaku killer", but later they find out it was just a killer using anime as an excuse. I think that could be the case here....Donutsonfire 00:07, January 19, 2011 (UTC) That sounds like it was based off of him. He didn't actually try to use it as an excuse. He happily admitted to the murders, and I believe he even laughed in the courtroom. The media got access to his house and found his extensive collection of horror hentai and movies. They published it in all the papers and basically reported that his obsession with horror anime and movies must have been why he was a serial killer. Most people believe everything in the media, so naturally they decided all otaku were bad people.'Turambar1 ''' 02:34, January 19, 2011 (UTC) Oh, now thats extra info i have not heard about! Ah, tsk tsk it took only 1 guy to screw up the image of anime and manga lovers worldwide....Donutsonfire 02:42, January 19, 2011 (UTC)